Gutpunching give/take/trade

The comments from almost everyone, but especially RadnerBearmen, Mutz, ctrwash, musclewrestlerviennea all have much merit. It is true that the lower ab muscles tend to be thinner than the upper ones. That’s why bladder shots aren’t a good idea and potentially dangerous. There are ab exercises that target the lower abs to help mitigate this issue.

I can testify that after thousands of self-punches I’m still around to give myself thousands more for self-training. Only after maybe doing 500-600 self-punches does a little soreness creep in, and that’s with fists. It seems to me that it takes more and more to even begin to get myself sore.

Funny thing: In high school I remember one of our p.e. coaches had us laying down self-beating our abs. “Beat it out,” he used to say. I wasn’t in football, but it seems like they also had the football players self-punch even more.

In my humble opinion, with good training and responsible opponents, the risk of injury is nil. As Magneto commented, “…be careful and choose partners who respect limits.”

From an anatomical point of view, your internal organs of your abdomen are relatively very well protected. Generally trauma only really occur in motor vehicle accidents, falls from a considerable height, and should your run into something generally going quite fast either on foot, as you would be if your were running. Or riding a bicycle. Younger children are more susceptible to such injuries due to relative thinness of the abdominal wall as well as the position of the organs like the liver which is lower. But from the age of ten we have seen less evidence of incapacity especially in girls. Is that because physiologically they develop faster than the boys?

I've seen dozens of youngsters get gut punched in the dojo and keep on going. One kid I know can take can take punches to his stomach, without really effecting him. A future member? He seems to enjoy it. The intestines can tolerate a lot of compression. The only exception being is when you have a lot of gas, but you will know that, as you will feel bloated. The only time they and most folks go down is when the opponent manages to punch deep into the triangular area just under the sternum. Striking the only exposed part of your liver.

Another feature is the greater omentum (also the great omentum, omentum majus, gastrocolic omentum, epiploon, or, especially in animals, caul) is a large apron-like fold of visceral peritoneum that hangs down from the stomach. It extends from the greater curvature of the stomach, passing in front of the small intestines and reflects on itself to ascend to the transverse colon before reaching to the posterior abdominal wall. The greater omentum is larger than the lesser omentum which hangs down from the liver to the lesser curvature. The common anatomical term "epiploic" derives from "epiploon" from the Greek "epipleein" meaning to float or sail on, since the greater omentum appears to float on the surface of the intestines. It thickens on response to potential injury. Like punching, with regular exposure it will respond faster. It also explains how someone can take a lot of punishment, as evidenced by some of the members of this group.

Keep it sane, keep it safe.

in a nutshell!?

Hey...good post. All said, we are fairly tough animals with our wall of abs. Around them are tissues that can adjust. Just as you use dumbbells or barbells, etc. to break down bicep muscle and rebuild, likewise leg-raise routines and punching of the abs break down and build tougher abs. Kind of nice that nature allows us this hot activity, huh?

exactly:
first know what you want
second choose a reliable opponent, not a stupid unilateral sadist.

...Which could be summarized as "Have some common sense". But then again, that should not have to be spelled out, except maybe for guys like ritchy england.

exactly! there are risks in life, and one should know which ones to accept..

The point was that with a healthy, uninjured body and properly conditioned/strenghtened/trained muscles, abs flexed, and your body left free to repel from the impact, you can take any kind of shot to the gut from another person, be it a barefist punch, a barefoot kick or a knee, even if the giver is much heavier than you. If your abs and skeletal muscles are strong enough and are properly working, the impact of the hit will at most repel you backwards. This scenario therefore is quite low risk. I've been kicked across the room in kickboxing training by much bigger guys and I barely felt it.

Take away any of these conditions (lack of health, body or abs not trained properly/not strong enough, abs not flexed, body blocked from repelling away from impact, giver using tools, etc.) and you gradually descend into more and more risk.

Most often the receiver's body is not healthy and also not conditioned properly. In these cases full out gut work would not be advised; instead the amount of force/power/impact exerted should always be sensibly balanced by the capability of resistance offered by the receiver. This is a risk in all contact sports.

true: sadists are wrong on a fight site, and to lega implications.laws in mostr countries exclude martial arts from respsibilities for injuries during a fight.

I usually take unflexed and always good hard hits. Always pushing limits and pain threshold, I guess I do take a big risk every time I do a session

there is no reisk if you have strong abs to flex, and if your partner rerspects the stop word.

That is completely correct based on my experience

I just had a doctor who is not part of the GP scene lecturing me about ruptured spleens and lacerated livers. That's why I ask punchers to aim for my navel (in other words, the intestines).

Dear whifferdill, if it were not for your justified fear, where would you like to suffer? Always from the navel down or just at the height of the stomach?

if hits go to the center of your abs - not toi the liver or to the ribs- the health risk is zero

That's actually not true. I've had two friends who were very well conditioned, injured while taking GP shots to the midsection, center navel and all. there are vital organs, veins and the like behind the center core too that can also be damaged or bruised. People just need to be careful and choose partners who respect limits.

Any details?

what details do you mean?

I was asking details from Magneto.

there is absolutely no actionin life without risks, and thre most important thing is to choose a relisable psartner who respects the rules and the stop word.I also prefer partners who are willing o swap roles, instead of stupid sados who have no idea about what it feels to be punched.

In The navel is hot

I have been taking punches to the gut since I was 15. I boxed Golden Gloves 8 years and still box and now kick box a lot. I am in shape for this. I train for this. I have never been damaged other than real sore. Its all about conditioning and doing it right.

I can vouch for RadnerBearman. He is tough, and is training me regularly. I find I am tougher than I thought, and with his help I do not fear damage any longer. Our abs and underlying sheath are there for a reason because our ribs aren't; otherwise we would be openly vulnerable. Our front wall is incredibly tough if we condition it.

I agree I have trained my absegularly, and I had only once a critical moment: when a hard punch came right into my solarplexus ( incidently) I collapsed and hurt my shoulder, because we did the gp on a hard floor.... But if one is afraid of such minor injuries one should not even start with martial arts...

Interesting that some guys claim the solar plexus is a very vulnerable area. It may be for some, worked over by skilled boxers who use deep uppercuts. However, in my training I have not yet had a problem, even with hard hits to mine. Time will tell. The tougher the abs become through training, the less likely any damage can occur.

I have punched hundreds of guys over the years. I never saw the need to punch anyone until his guts were damaged. The point to to have some fun with each other.

If not done right there are definitely dangers.
http://www.theshotokanway.com/hittingsolarplexus.html

are really dangerous blows to the stomach?

nothing a human can do unaided (as in not using tools, e.g. weight hammers) - but only if you are properly conditioned, and your muscles are flexed while receiving.

if you are not conditioned properly, or receive while unflexed, then there indeed are risks, so you should be careful.